Mad idea?

[Geezer]

I don't know a bike engine would be that much fun in a Mk1. They're amazing machines but I wonder if it would be happy having to push nearly a tonne of metal instead of just a couple of wheels, some space frame and enough bits to hold on to.

[PW@Woodsport]

i honestly wouldnt bother trying to fit a bike engine,the end result will dissapoint,not enough torque and too much chassis weight.... you will also give yourself a bundle of headaches with drivetrain etc,it would be a pure novelty factor conversion.

If you want something different and the 3sgte isnt for you then stick a lightweight 1mz v6 in there and supercharge it like im doing to mine.... bu88er all weight and enough torque to pull up tree stumps,plus its a sh*tload easier and still all toyota under the engine lid.

[crazybrightman]

ok ok ive gone off the bike thing ill have to build a kit car for that, or most likely just buy the dam bike and ride it much more fun
so the v6 is sounding very interestin im guessing an all alloy one of these doesnt really weigh much more than a 4age? which one though as there seems to be a 2.5, 3.0, 3.3 and a vvti version! sod the supercharger though twin turbo sounds better

[midenginedmaniac]

People keep on saying not enough torque so how much does a MK1 put out ?

[monkeymax]

People keep on saying not enough torque so how much does a MK1 put out ?

I said that in my earlier post...

I think that the 4AGE as standard (and new) peaked at around the 130Nm mark - so around 96ft'ib.

So it's not a very torquey engine as standard... That's with 120bhp output.

[crazybrightman]

the thing is looking into it to buy and turbo a busa lump doing all the work myself is easily £3000+ for that money i could have a car engine in there running over 300bhp and 300ft'lb torque. the only advantage to the bike engine would be a bit less weight and the gearbox. but in the scale of things the engine is no where near that influencial on the overall weight of the car the rolling shell alone must be nearly 700kg stripped out, not a 350kg kit car. one day tho maybe ill try it with the new zzr 1400 engine turbo'd that should be fun

[LimeyMk1]

so the v6 is sounding very interestin im guessing an all alloy one of these doesnt really weigh much more than a 4age? which one though as there seems to be a 2.5, 3.0, 3.3 and a vvti version! sod the supercharger though twin turbo sounds better

2 people can lift a 1MZFE relatively easily (Jaspa & RedMk1) and I don't have too much difficulty moving the engine and tubby gearbox round the garage on the dolly I made. I'd say it weighs a fair bit more than the 4AGE/gearbox combo tho.

Go for either the 3 or 3.3l ones, the 2.5 is not worth it at all. Johnny G is having a 3.3 turblo put into a Mk2 and IIRC there are a couple of Turblo 3.0 MZ's in the States (www.mr2oc.com). Not sure what the logistics of fitting a twin snailed engine to the Mk1 would be. Paul?

My build has so far gone over the £3k mark in parts alone and I picked up my VVTi MZ for £50. But then I am going to be running it with ITBs and an aftermarket ECU.

[midenginedmaniac]

People keep on saying not enough torque so how much does a MK1 put out ?

I said that in my earlier post...

I think that the 4AGE as standard (and new) peaked at around the 130Nm mark - so around 96ft'ib.

So it's not a very torquey engine as standard... That's with 120bhp output.

Thanks for that. The stock busa lump would have around the same torque but 60 more BHP. And rev its nuts off

I think its about being different not the fastest.

[PW@Woodsport]

fitting a supercharged all alloy v6 to a mk1 isnt different enough for you?

im advising against the bike engined swap because the guy will have £4k plus invested in it and it will dissapoint, £4k better off spent on making the thing fly as well as being different.

Now when someone manages to nail two busa engines together in a v8 fashion like harris did with two exup lumps back in the nineties then im interested!

[scomr2]

fitting a supercharged all alloy v6 to a mk1 isnt different enough for you?

Now when someone manages to nail two busa engines together in a v8 fashion like harris did with two exup lumps back in the nineties then im interested!

Actually somebody already has see http://www.powertecracing.com/ and they are not the only ones!

A better bike engine to the transplant into a mk1 might be the 2.3litre Triumph Rocket.

Having both a mk1 and a bec I can tell you that you have to use the gears to keep the bike engine spinning in the 6000rpm plus region to get decent acceleration. bec is bike engined car btw not bike spelled badly!

[PW@Woodsport]

shame its so costly to do,those engines would be amazing in a mk1

[crazybrightman]

dam those v8's look sweet then again for £20000+ i should think so
so wheres the best place to get up to speed on these v6's then?

[PW@Woodsport]

www.twobrutal.com

[PW@Woodsport]

oh and my own 1mz-fe (all alloy) Supercharged v6 mk1,drivetrain probably weighs 10-20kgs more than a 4a-ge set up...





Still a work in progress but this thing is going to fly

[OlberJ]

If you're really wanting to go twin turbo and be different, put the V6 in longditudinally with a suitable box (Audi 80 we know will pretty much work).

That way you got room for both snails off each bank and i dare say it'd require minimal cutting of the front firewall.

3VZ will handle a fair bit of boost we're told, so with some decent management and some custom driveshafts, extended gear cables and a welder, it's plug n play. Almost.

Something i plan to do when i get the funds.

Would it be sequential turbos to give a good power range or to get a big power figure?

Sequential is a pain in the ar$e to plumb and get working and the V6 can output enough flow to spin up a fairly large turbo instantly so very little or no lag problems.

Single turbo, the V6 install is easy, jus put the turbo in boot, keep the engine transverse.

Twin turbo would mean inline, 2 same sized turbos, or 2 turbos in boot?

Infact, if it's just a track car, stick 2 CT20's in the boot remotely and feed them back through a chargecooler on top of the engine, should see near enough 400BHP out of that quite easily.

[crazybrightman]

blimey thats shoe horned into there well! wouldnt fancy changing the plugs on the rear bank though something tells me that the letters trd also mean silly money or is that not always the case?
looking at the space avaliable a single turbo either above the gearbox or slung down behind the rear bank would be best. turbos located in the boot would have terrible spool as they are so far from the engine and lot of the exhaust energy would be lost by the time it gets to the turbo. maybe ill go down another route that maybe more simple a 4cyl is alot easier to fit and plum in with all the turbo gubbings.

[PW@Woodsport]

changing the rear plugs is easy,ive got an access panel in the boot wall.

remote turbo charging works really well,theres no more lag than you would expect with a turbo mounted right on the engine,plus it has its benefits,no heat soak and the longer IC pipework aids cooling.

Keep the exhaust tubing small in diameter from engine to turbo and the spooling will be instant.

[superchargedsam]

or ditch the AW11 chassis and use the drivetrain in another amazing handling chassis:



I pick this up next week, basically the rear end of the mini has been cut out and welded into a space frame chassis, its everything, the suspension, engine box driveshafts hubs, brakes etc. Estimated to be circa 700kilos should be awesome fun but over the winter will be dropping my spare 4AGZE in there with a big pulley and charge cooler and flowed head and tubular headers so should be good for 185-215bhp. Front end is a FG one piece flip front with an ally fuel cell and rad and thats it. All rear windows are perspex and you take the back one out to work on the 4AGE. First job is carbon fibre doors with perspex windows and no mechs and the seats in it are also the MK1 seats from the doner car so plenty of weight to be lost there. Track is wider than standard mini so is nearly perfectly square and dry hadnling is unreal. Am also heavily into bikes but dont think a bike engine would be that great in an AW11 chassis TBH. Zcars do a 450bhp busa engined space framed mini but your talking £25k I believe for the whole package completed so not a cheap option. Your really only lmited by your imagination (closely followed by ya wallet) as to what can be done as can be seen on twobrutal.

[crazybrightman]

ok then so how tall is a 3sgte? because all the engines i can think of are a good 100mm+ taller than the 4age and thats basically means the sumps going to be on the floor!

[kevin..in]

ok then so how tall is a 3sgte? because all the engines i can think of are a good 100mm+ taller than the 4age and thats basically means the sumps going to be on the floor!

I think they must fit otherwise all the conversions done so far have holed sumps