Had my first Spin today....... Any Advice?

[Danbob]

So this morning I experienced the Mid Engine handling characteristics of my car fully lol. It was wet, I was turning off a round about onto a curved slip road, as I was getting onto the slip road (two lanes) I glanced right and saw a MK3 MR2 overtaking me, having only had the car out on the road a couple of times I was keen to see what it could do, so I put my foot down. The car started to power oversteer, I was wary of lifting off, fearing the consequences, probably corrected a little to late, car snapped back the other way and left me 90degrees to the flow of traffic.
Luckily the road was quiet and I had plenty of time to straighten up and drive off before anyone reached me, but was left feeling a bit silly!

So this is my first RWD car, and obviously first Mid engined car.

I know what I SHOULD do to prevent myself getting into a spin in the first place. but what I want to know is, what should I have done at that point when the rear end had already started sliding, to bring it back in and prevent it snapping back the other way? When you have messed up and a corner, what is the best way to act to bring it back.

My best guess is that I should have lifted off just a little to try and bring the rear wheel speed back down to the road speed but not too much that the weight is shifted too far off the rear wheels? Bearing in mind this was power oversteer rather than lift off oversteer, I would also like any opinions on trying to correct a lift off oversteer slide aswell.

I am keen to master this car and won't be letting this put me off!

Cheers
Dan

[Draven]

Question...

Is it wet...

Answer

Yes

Am I going to crash if i drive quick?

Yup


This is the lesson I learned.. after doing a 180 on a dual carriage way.



The MR2 has interesting characteristics i think the best way to describe it.

Grip Grip Grip Grip --- Hedge..

[dazzz]

Should've kept your foot buried in the floor and turned it into a full 360, then drove off like a boss.

On a serious note, practice sliding it.

[big_joe]

I don't see why anyone would be putting their foot down in an MR2 in the wet..........it's just a pointless risk. Save it for dry days

[ghostrider88]

I don't see why anyone would be putting their foot down in an MR2 in the wet..........it's just a pointless risk. Save it for dry days

totally agree with you. The mr2 is known to be unforgiving if you drive on the edge and pull it to far. Personally i wold not dear to try anything risky at the wet..

[John145]

There was a video posted on here a while back that demonstrated a very similar scenario - wet, coming onto a wet roundabout, got a tiny bit of oversteer, way too much lock to correct and tank slapped the opposite way into the curb.

Simple truth is most people who drive an MR2 have never experienced oversteer and when a slide begins they apply anywhere from 180 degrees to full steering lock of counter steer, the car recovers and instantly turns the other direction faster - snap oversteer.

It isn't the car's fault as many people blame! It's just inexperience and we have all had to learn.

In future try the following:

Learn the neutral throttle position - the throttle position that will maintain speed or slightly slow the car, when you feel the back end move this is the throttle position you want to naturally adopt to get traction to the rear wheels quickly. Jumping off the throttle is BAD! Going full throttle is WORSE!

Do not use any more than 45 degrees steering input from the straight ahead to initially correct, if the slide continued GRADUALLY apply more lock.

And most importantly, when the slide has been caught bring the steering wheel back to the neutral position. A lot of people will leave a lot of opposite lock on even though the correction has been made, this leads to "snap oversteer".

Finally, if you have gone to full lock to try to recover but are continuing to spin, give up - full brake and clutch in. You aren't going to recover past full lock. If you continue to try you will end up with the car turning further than the original path, locking up and braking will see you spin and have a better chance of staying on the tarmac.

Good luck!

[Draven]

On another note.. you're littlerally just a hop skip and a jump down the road from me..



If you want to meet up discuss mr2's etc lemme know.

[alanmr2turbo]

1st mistake
Wanting to see what your Tubby could do against a MK3 Totally pointless and why even bother?

2nd mistake
Seeing what your car can do without even getting used to the car first...... build up slowly.

3rd mistake
Seeing what your car can do in the wet.

[John145]

Also on the topic of lift off oversteer, it is progressive - more so than power on oversteer. Same rules apply as I posted earlier. What put you in a spin was the steering wheel not the throttle.

[Danbob]

There was a video posted on here a while back that demonstrated a very similar scenario - wet, coming onto a wet roundabout, got a tiny bit of oversteer, way too much lock to correct and tank slapped the opposite way into the curb.

Simple truth is most people who drive an MR2 have never experienced oversteer and when a slide begins they apply anywhere from 180 degrees to full steering lock of counter steer, the car recovers and instantly turns the other direction faster - snap oversteer.

It isn't the car's fault as many people blame! It's just inexperience and we have all had to learn.

In future try the following:

Learn the neutral throttle position - the throttle position that will maintain speed or slightly slow the car, when you feel the back end move this is the throttle position you want to naturally adopt to get traction to the rear wheels quickly. Jumping off the throttle is BAD! Going full throttle is WORSE!

Do not use any more than 45 degrees steering input from the straight ahead to initially correct, if the slide continued GRADUALLY apply more lock.

And most importantly, when the slide has been caught bring the steering wheel back to the neutral position. A lot of people will leave a lot of opposite lock on even though the correction has been made, this leads to "snap oversteer".

Finally, if you have gone to full lock to try to recover but are continuing to spin, give up - full brake and clutch in. You aren't going to recover past full lock. If you continue to try you will end up with the car turning further than the original path, locking up and braking will see you spin and have a better chance of staying on the tarmac.

Good luck!

Cheers, this exactly the type of response I was looking for. Very useful, I think the balance of how much throttle to catch it is what I need to practice.


In reply to many of the other responses, I know it was my fault, and as I stated I know what I should and should not do in order to avoid a spin. But the question was what the best course of action is once the mistake has already been made and you're trying to correct.

Cheers

[Danbob]

On another note.. you're littlerally just a hop skip and a jump down the road from me..



If you want to meet up discuss mr2's etc lemme know.

Yeah sounds good, seems to be a surprising amount of MR2's around the area. Now that my cars on the road I'll try and get to some MK meets etc. and introduce myself!

[Marlowe]

A very good post from John - I experienced my first fishtail the other night in similar situations (wet /greasy road, joining a long straight empty road after coming off of a round about), and snapped oversteered spectacularly.

This is my first RWD car, let alone mid-engined, so I'm very keen to build confidence with handling spins also - I managed to snap oversteer a gen 7 celica once into a kerb on a flood-damaged road at 20mph (very embarrassing, given the speed and the fact that it was the standard fwd 140bhp variant) and have always been wary since (thankfully haven't repeated in the MR2 or the GTI yet).

[Steve-O 2007]

Well there is only one thing that you can do..... Become Japanese... Those guys know how to handle the MR2 when it comes to side ways action

[Steve-O 2007]

Were you steering at the time of putting the foot down or in a straight line???

if In a straight line maybe get all your bushes / suspension components checked.

What tyres are you using as well and what sizes?

My MR2 was fine in the wet I could mash my foot to the floor spinning the rears up and then going on hitting the limiter in gears all the way to 100 odd with no problems... (on the strip in the pouring rain which was just an airfield drag racing strip day)

Even on the road in the wet I had no problems

In fact I even used it in the snow with no problems -

[sidewaysmk2tubby]

I think everyone who has had a 2 a while will say to be so carefull in the wet. I've spun it 5 times round one morning coming off a blind crest to find the road was closed due to another accident. Shame about the traffic cops stood watching me and the poor paramedics running away fromt he ambulance parked in the middle of the road.
Never again have i put my foot down in the wet.
(i did hold the spin and ended up facing the right way in the lane that i was in originally, then just pulled over to a layby like nothing had happened )

sorry on a side note Alanmr2turbo where do you get your car washed and when are they open? look like a good service offered

[Danbob]

I was steering at the time, fairly gently, but enough for it to be the cause of the original skid.

Tyres are Toyo T1Rs, 195/55R15 Fronts 225/50R15 Rears almost new. I've been in the same situation in the dry and the car was completely planted and predictable, I know now that in the wet it is a completely different beast!

About to go and drive it home now! Looking forward to it, it's good to at least have a car which keeps you interested lol

[Marlowe]

Were you steering at the time of putting the foot down or in a straight line???

if In a straight line maybe get all your bushes / suspension components checked.

What tyres are you using as well and what sizes?

Image Replaced With URL For Quote http://a1.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos- ... 6890_n.jpg

For mine, was straight and I thought I was babying it due to it being in the wet - I had applied a lot more power in the dry wihout issues. I'm hoping it was the tyres that weren't gripping as well standard 15" sizes (225 / 50 rears & 195 55 fronts), but all budget - rear nexens and champiro / some other random brand on front - had the lot replaced with the Toyo Proxies I ordered from mytyres this morning.

Suspension could worth a look but I've had no issues with similar power in the dry so I'm hoping it's more a traction issue as you suggested.

Either way as Danbob said, I'm going to be taking it a lot more steady - especially on the drive to the Norschleife next Sunday!

[psummers]

Please don't accelerate when you see someone trying to overtake you.

I don't know the exact layout of the road that you were on, but if the 2 lanes from the slip were merging into 1 lane on the dual carrageway/motorway then you could have caused a serious accident.

I used to hate in in my n/a when you go to overtake someone only for them to floor it. I either had to back out or slowly creep past rather than passing them quickly and safely. Since getting my turbo this has been less of a problem though, they usually don't have time to react

As for how to correct a spin what John145 was good.

[jasongtr]

first rwd car, first rwd mid engined car, wet, steering lock applied, engaging another car........ jesus get used to the car before you hurt someone

is it your 1st turbo car too - thats even worse, power delivery isnt exactly NA like, in the wet just makes it worse as you found out

slow down fella until you are used to the car and its characteristics, especially in the wet

[jasongtr]

also i would add to try a trackday where you can explore the car in a safer environment