[Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

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Ryan S
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Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

Post by Ryan S »

rs007 wrote:Good grief :-k

I was having a giggle mate, especially with the use of the word primitive - you can have a perfectly good technical discussion and still include a little banter/humour. No willy waving here (mine is tiny and I don't know as many big words as you anyway :D)

*note smillie; used to denote good humoured banter*

Something that does seem to be sadly lacking from many an internet forum, car based ones especially - odd - I'll try to get into the Vulcan mindset lol

As you all were gentlemen!



:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
rs007
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Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

Post by rs007 »

sheppy wrote:
rs007 wrote:Good grief :-k

I was having a giggle mate, especially with the use of the word primitive - you can have a perfectly good technical discussion and still include a little banter/humour. No willy waving here (mine is tiny and I don't know as many big words as you anyway :D)

*note smillie; used to denote good humoured banter*

Something that does seem to be sadly lacking from many an internet forum, car based ones especially - odd - I'll try to get into the Vulcan mindset lol

As you all were gentlemen!



:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:



Don't you start lol :D
Turbonoz
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Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

Post by Turbonoz »

Fine, have an emoticon overload if it makes the internet feel nicer for you: :D :lol: :eye: \:D/

Doesn't make your posts in this thread any less misinformed Image

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
92 MR2 Turbo Rev2 stock engine, Link G3 TURBONOZ mapped, T78: 487bhp & 364lbft; 11.78@120. NOW BREAKING: www.imoc.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?p=1542658
94 GTiR: 12.08@115 TOTB Sold :(
92 300ZX: 12.6@113 (415bhp) 570bhp, 500lbft
00 Clio 172
05 WRX PPP
rs007
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Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

Post by rs007 »

Noz_13 wrote:Fine, have an emoticon overload if it makes the internet feel nicer for you: :D :lol: :eye: \:D/

Doesn't make your posts in this thread any less misinformed Image

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:



Right thats it, me n you, internet b1tch fight, OUTSIDE NOW

:D

I may be misinformed, by you sir are overopinionated

Ner!!!
Ryan S
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Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

Post by Ryan S »

yeah man, calm down, :lol: enjoy your write ups but your rants are borderline insanity :lol: :lol:
Turbonoz
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Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

Post by Turbonoz »

rs007 wrote:
Noz_13 wrote:Fine, have an emoticon overload if it makes the internet feel nicer for you: :D :lol: :eye: \:D/

Doesn't make your posts in this thread any less misinformed Image

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:



Right thats it, me n you, internet b1tch fight, OUTSIDE NOW

:D

I may be misinformed, by you sir are overopinionated

Ner!!!


Hahaha, let's have it mate!!

When my "opinions" are no longer based on fact & experience, then I will be guilty of posting simply for the sake of it.

Many people believe 440cc injectors are "maxed out" way before they actually are. Many people believe you can't run more than 16 psi of boost on a CT26. Many people believe you need forged pistons before you actually do. Japanese metal was made to be pushed, I struggle to think of one JDM vehicle that was stressed from the factory. 400bhp on a stock 4cyl 1.8-2.0L Japanese engine is easily attainable if you know what you're doing. If you have ever worked with 'lesser' vehicles (eg. Rover Turbos (HG, gearboxes, pistons, electrics), Fiat Turbos (electrics), Ford Cosworths (electrics)), you will get where I'm coming from.

Eg. Stock MR2 440/550cc injectors vs Cossie 270cc yellows/blues. It's just the Denso ECUs that are a stumbling block.
92 MR2 Turbo Rev2 stock engine, Link G3 TURBONOZ mapped, T78: 487bhp & 364lbft; 11.78@120. NOW BREAKING: www.imoc.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?p=1542658
94 GTiR: 12.08@115 TOTB Sold :(
92 300ZX: 12.6@113 (415bhp) 570bhp, 500lbft
00 Clio 172
05 WRX PPP
Turbonoz
Posts: 727
Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2011 6:31 am

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

Post by Turbonoz »

sheppy wrote:yeah man, calm down, :lol: enjoy your write ups but your rants are borderline insanity :lol: :lol:


Heh, ram it! When you two bumboys can post more than just :lol: :D :lol: :D :lol: :D , then maybe it will matter to me what you think Image

I'm perfectly calm, just popped in for a few mins to warm the cockles. Must be -5 outside!

By the way, still got my old Forester? Your old Zed is the fastest Auto in the UK right now. Please tell me it wasn't you that filled the coolant system with K-Seal to plug the pinhole in the rad end cap, although given your borderline retarded posts, I'm betting it was :thumleft:

xxx
92 MR2 Turbo Rev2 stock engine, Link G3 TURBONOZ mapped, T78: 487bhp & 364lbft; 11.78@120. NOW BREAKING: www.imoc.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?p=1542658
94 GTiR: 12.08@115 TOTB Sold :(
92 300ZX: 12.6@113 (415bhp) 570bhp, 500lbft
00 Clio 172
05 WRX PPP
rs007
Posts: 285
Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2012 9:30 pm

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

Post by rs007 »

Noz_13 wrote:
Hahaha, let's have it mate!!

When my "opinions" are no longer based on fact & experience, then I will be guilty of posting simply for the sake of it.

Many people believe 440cc injectors are "maxed out" way before they actually are. Many people believe you can't run more than 16 psi of boost on a CT26. Many people believe you need forged pistons before you actually do. Japanese metal was made to be pushed, I struggle to think of one JDM vehicle that was stressed from the factory. 400bhp on a stock 4cyl 1.8-2.0L Japanese engine is easily attainable if you know what you're doing. If you have ever worked with 'lesser' vehicles (eg. Rover Turbos (HG, gearboxes, pistons, electrics), Fiat Turbos (electrics), Ford Cosworths (electrics)), you will get where I'm coming from.

Eg. Stock MR2 440/550cc injectors vs Cossie 270cc yellows/blues. It's just the Denso ECUs that are a stumbling block.



I totally get you - mate I'll say again - we weren't disagreeing, you were just picking up, correctly, incorrectly, who cares - on stuff I was saying unnecessarily to make some sort of point - understandably I see now given the above post because I can see it bugs your nipple-ends continually seeing bullsh1t stated as fact.

If I may stray to the verbose for one second :D I am fairly prominent in the UK bodybuilding scene, and help run one of the biggest UK forums for that weirdest of pass-times.

If you think this car game is bad for myth being repeated so much it becomes actual concrete fact, you want to see bodybuilding - so full of nonsense "facts" it isn't right, and I am known for breaking a lot of them down, just like you have done in the above post - so I can relate - but I'm not one of those guys mate, not by a long shot.

Anyway, lets move on, you just told me my car will make 400bhp if I tweak it right, you are my new best mate :D
rs007
Posts: 285
Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2012 9:30 pm

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

Post by rs007 »

Noz_13 wrote:
sheppy wrote:yeah man, calm down, :lol: enjoy your write ups but your rants are borderline insanity :lol: :lol:


Heh, ram it! When you two bumboys can post more than just :lol: :D :lol: :D :lol: :D , then maybe it will matter to me what you think Image

I'm perfectly calm, just popped in for a few mins to warm the cockles. Must be -5 outside!

By the way, still got my old Forester? Your old Zed is the fastest Auto in the UK right now. Please tell me it wasn't you that filled the coolant system with K-Seal to plug the pinhole in the rad end cap, although given your borderline retarded posts, I'm betting it was :thumleft:

xxx



He is Scottish - well living in Dundee at least - the K-Seal was def him, no doubt about it, we are a bit "special" up here :D
Ryan S
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Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

Post by Ryan S »

Noz_13 wrote:
sheppy wrote:yeah man, calm down, :lol: enjoy your write ups but your rants are borderline insanity :lol: :lol:


Heh, ram it! When you two bumboys can post more than just :lol: :D :lol: :D :lol: :D , then maybe it will matter to me what you think Image Replaced With URL For Quote http://www.acuraworld.com/forums/images ... smiley.gif

I'm perfectly calm, just popped in for a few mins to warm the cockles. Must be -5 outside!

By the way, still got my old Forester? Your old Zed is the fastest Auto in the UK right now. Please tell me it wasn't you that filled the coolant system with K-Seal to plug the pinhole in the rad end cap, although given your borderline retarded posts, I'm betting it was :thumleft:

xxx


na that forester was a binner man, the diff was knackered, no wasn't me man, i only had the car for a few months never had a problem with it once, feck, i drove it down to newcastle, it never even battered an eyelid :)
greeny
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Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

Post by greeny »

bobhatton wrote:

With road fuel stock boost is the only safe way because there is always detonation when the boost is turned up and that’s when the gasket or ring lands go


So anything above stock boost on pump fuel, you're going to get detonation and pop the gasket/ringland......... :roll:
TOTB 2010 Rwd top speed, 1/4 and shootout winner.
10.7@142 on R888 street tyres, 10.3@134mph on slicks,
9's on slicks to come, with a clean full throttle pass! Goal of 0-150mph in a 1/4 of a mile....
Turbonoz
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Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

Post by Turbonoz »

rs007 wrote:
I totally get you - mate I'll say again - we weren't disagreeing, you were just picking up, correctly, incorrectly, who cares - on stuff I was saying unnecessarily to make some sort of point - understandably I see now given the above post because I can see it bugs your nipple-ends continually seeing bullsh1t stated as fact.

If I may stray to the verbose for one second :D I am fairly prominent in the UK bodybuilding scene, and help run one of the biggest UK forums for that weirdest of pass-times.

If you think this car game is bad for myth being repeated so much it becomes actual concrete fact, you want to see bodybuilding - so full of nonsense "facts" it isn't right, and I am known for breaking a lot of them down, just like you have done in the above post - so I can relate - but I'm not one of those guys mate, not by a long shot.

Anyway, lets move on, you just told me my car will make 400bhp if I tweak it right, you are my new best mate :D


You don't scare me pal, I'll kick you in your shrivelled testes!!

T.F.S. runs 350bhp on a stock HG, last year I ran 1.5 bar on a T78 with a bone stock engine, and raped it up the strip with full bore 6k rpm launches most weekends. 2+ bar boost next year as I was limited due to the internal map sensor in the Link ECU. Bob Hatton runs 1.5 bar on his, albeit on race fuel, which is the way to do it on the stock ECU to avoid the onset of knock and the subsequent timing that is pulled.

For a solid 400bhp 2L without forged internals, I would go with the following:
Holset HX35/BW S200/GT35 etc. Large frame turbo with 0.86ish A/R turbine housing.
Top feed fuel rail
720+cc injectors (can be done on smaller, but if you're buying new gear and not maximising, may as well be future proof)
Uprated fuel pump
Adjustable FPR for 3+ bar fuel pressure
Standalone ECU, the tuning of which is by far and away the most important aspect.
2mm MHG (I know some will disagree, but lowered comp with more boost is just 'easier' on a stock bottom end IMO)
Massive boot mount IC with good airflow or a very good CC
Exhaust, filter, BCR8ES plugs etc etc.

Cams will make it so much easier, but then it wouldn't be a stock engine
Water injection (like cams, not required but makes everything so much easier).

The main thing is to keep the intake air temps as low as possible and just have everything overspecced slightly size-wise. Big turbo, big cooling. But not T78-big. That is just silly and a pain in the ar$e on a stock 2L ](*,) Then it's simply all about the mapping.

Actually, other than the ECU situation there is the block-cracking phenomenon. Some go, some don't.
92 MR2 Turbo Rev2 stock engine, Link G3 TURBONOZ mapped, T78: 487bhp & 364lbft; 11.78@120. NOW BREAKING: www.imoc.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?p=1542658
94 GTiR: 12.08@115 TOTB Sold :(
92 300ZX: 12.6@113 (415bhp) 570bhp, 500lbft
00 Clio 172
05 WRX PPP
rs007
Posts: 285
Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2012 9:30 pm

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

Post by rs007 »

Noz_13 wrote:
rs007 wrote:
I totally get you - mate I'll say again - we weren't disagreeing, you were just picking up, correctly, incorrectly, who cares - on stuff I was saying unnecessarily to make some sort of point - understandably I see now given the above post because I can see it bugs your nipple-ends continually seeing bullsh1t stated as fact.

If I may stray to the verbose for one second :D I am fairly prominent in the UK bodybuilding scene, and help run one of the biggest UK forums for that weirdest of pass-times.

If you think this car game is bad for myth being repeated so much it becomes actual concrete fact, you want to see bodybuilding - so full of nonsense "facts" it isn't right, and I am known for breaking a lot of them down, just like you have done in the above post - so I can relate - but I'm not one of those guys mate, not by a long shot.

Anyway, lets move on, you just told me my car will make 400bhp if I tweak it right, you are my new best mate :D


You don't scare me pal, I'll kick you in your shrivelled testes!!

T.F.S. runs 350bhp on a stock HG, last year I ran 1.5 bar on a T78 with a bone stock engine, and raped it up the strip with full bore 6k rpm launches most weekends. 2+ bar boost next year as I was limited due to the internal map sensor in the Link ECU. Bob Hatton runs 1.5 bar on his, albeit on race fuel, which is the way to do it on the stock ECU to avoid the onset of knock and the subsequent timing that is pulled.

For a solid 400bhp 2L without forged internals, I would go with the following:
Holset HX35/BW S200/GT30/GT35 etc. Large frame turbo with 0.86+ A/R turbine housing.
Top feed fuel rail
720+cc injectors (can be done on smaller, but if you're buying new gear and not maximising, may as well be future proof)
Uprated fuel pump
Adjustable FPR for 3+ bar fuel pressure
Standalone ECU, the tuning of which is by far and away the most important aspect.
2mm MHG (I know some will disagree, but lowered comp with more boost is just 'easier' on a stock bottom end IMO)
Massive boot mount IC with good airflow or a very good CC
Exhaust, filter, BCR8ES plugs etc etc.

Cams will make it so much easier, but then it wouldn't be a stock engine
Water injection (like cams, not required but makes everything so much easier).

The main thing is to keep the intake air temps as low as possible and just have everything overspecced slightly size-wise. Big turbo, big cooling. But not T78-big. That is just silly and a pain in the ar$e on a stock 2L ](*,) Then it's simply all about the mapping.

Actually, other than the ECU situation there is the block-cracking phenomenon. Some go, some don't.


If you can find em, hell I'll kick em myself, the steroids seen them off many years ago :lol:

Thanks for that post mate, mean that genuine btw, not sarcy! RE intake temps, I've recently done a couple of simple things (remember my car is more or less stock) - refitting the turbo heat shield that some previous nobber took off, and heat wrapping the IC-TB pipe - simple n cheap. The plenum chamber and IC-TB pipe used to actually burn to the touch (mine crosses over the exhaust manifold currently :roll:) - now it is barely warm to touch, ditto plenum. I haven't took before or after temps, but can feel the difference night and day.

Am I correct in my assumption that it isn't necessarily the boost that kills the engine as some would have you believe, but primarily the intake charge temp? Well, in that a lower one can stop detonation?

I want solid reliable power, 400bhp prob overkill, but whatever I have I want it all the way to the redline, mine drops off severely after 5.5k, boost just dives back to stock. Still to check and see if there is a leak somewhere, I have an idle issue to sort so I think there is def an inlet leak hiding...

But that post has inspired me a bit, after reading so much doom and gloom on these engines!
Turbonoz
Posts: 727
Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2011 6:31 am

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

Post by Turbonoz »

rs007 wrote:
If you can find em, hell I'll kick em myself, the steroids seen them off many years ago :lol:

Thanks for that post mate, mean that genuine btw, not sarcy! RE intake temps, I've recently done a couple of simple things (remember my car is more or less stock) - refitting the turbo heat shield that some previous nobber took off, and heat wrapping the IC-TB pipe - simple n cheap. The plenum chamber and IC-TB pipe used to actually burn to the touch (mine crosses over the exhaust manifold currently :roll:) - now it is barely warm to touch, ditto plenum. I haven't took before or after temps, but can feel the difference night and day.

Am I correct in my assumption that it isn't necessarily the boost that kills the engine as some would have you believe, but primarily the intake charge temp? Well, in that a lower one can stop detonation?

I want solid reliable power, 400bhp prob overkill, but whatever I have I want it all the way to the redline, mine drops off severely after 5.5k, boost just dives back to stock. Still to check and see if there is a leak somewhere, I have an idle issue to sort so I think there is def an inlet leak hiding...

But that post has inspired me a bit, after reading so much doom and gloom on these engines!


It's not boost, but airflow you should consider. Up to a point where cylinder pressures simply get too high and you start cracking blocks, lifting heads etc nothing should really fail as long as it's mapped correctly. Obviously things can go pear-shaped, so a slight element of luck is involved unless you're going to extreme lengths with material testing, blue-printing etc. Cracked ringlands, melted pistons etc are not indicative of the power levels that can be attained, simply how poorly the car was set up.

You're on the CT26 I take it? It can be run at 1.5 bar (note it isn't good for turbo longevity) and with good results providing everything is in place to support that. Bob Hatton uses race fuel on the stock ECU. I used a Link G3 & massive boot mount IC. Even on the stock ECU, with a fresh 255lph fuel pump I hit good AFRs of 11.5:1. Unlike Bob (I think), I held 1.35 bar at the redline. This will go against EVERYTHING you read elsewhere, stating that boost will drop off a cliff way before. I put it down to the BMIC & 3" piping I run everywhere. Once on the G3, I monitored IAT with the CT26 at 1.5 bar and there were no issues there at all. Think it was ambient +30° at full chat.

None of this takes into account drivability though. CT26 + BMIC loses a lot of responsiveness. The best set up I had was a top-mount intercooler. It was amazing!

It's not the engines that are the problem, it's the control system. I go through cars like nobody's business. I buy them to map the stock system, create amazing generic chips (lol) and then break them. I cannot make any money directly from owning my MR2 because I cannot map the damn stock ECU. And yet I keep it, alongside my Pulsar & 300zx which are development vehicles (and daily drivers!). It is hard to be competitive in the 4WD drag scene nowadays (especially in a fookin Sunny!), but my MR2 should be good to go in the RWD classes next year. I have a set of forged Wossner pistons right here for it, but I will continue to push the stock high mileage 3SGTE as far as possible!
92 MR2 Turbo Rev2 stock engine, Link G3 TURBONOZ mapped, T78: 487bhp & 364lbft; 11.78@120. NOW BREAKING: www.imoc.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?p=1542658
94 GTiR: 12.08@115 TOTB Sold :(
92 300ZX: 12.6@113 (415bhp) 570bhp, 500lbft
00 Clio 172
05 WRX PPP
rs007
Posts: 285
Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2012 9:30 pm

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

Post by rs007 »

Thanks again for in depth info!

See, this makes me think I def have an issue somewhere; I can't get me CT26 to boost much over 14ish psi, hit approx 17 the other night but it was an extremely cold, dense night. It performs faultlessly otherwise. I started a thread about it last week "is the CT26 really that crap" lol, standard reply was fit a CT20, which I am not averse to doing - but I want to be sure I have no other issues before I do, or I am just masking problems.

What, in your mind, other than a boost leak, would be causing it to not want to see boost higher, and for boost to be dropping off in the higher rev range?

I can't help thinking it cant be THAT bad, unless something else in the chain is letting it down.

I have high idle - as high as 1200 ish sometimes - but only when hot. If anything when cold it idles too low - I have my own sneaking suspicions on this (inlet leak somewhere combined with stuck ISCV, 2 probs, not one), and I will sort it just by being methodical - but would be interested in any thoughts if it will shorten the problem finding process.

But for you to say you are actually getting the CT26 to spin to 1.5bar, no way mines could. It does seem otherwise healthy, does have a receipt for being rebuilt not long before I got the car, no smoke, little play...

Once I am sure there are no actual problems (already sorted a lot) I'll be pushing this stock engine as far as I can within the realms of what I am willing to compromise on - you saying over 300 bhp should be straightforward to attain, with reliability, has cheered me up a bit, apparently all you'll get is 280ish, according to usual answers.

Anyway, less time on forums and more time out tinkering on it for me, off out to get frozen playing with bits of engine :D
Last edited by rs007 on Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
rs007
Posts: 285
Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2012 9:30 pm

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

Post by rs007 »

to bring it back round to what we started talking about, I haven't checked my fuel pressure - and the fuel filter looks ancient - thats getting changed today. I guess if fuel pressure was down, fuel delivery would be down, and this would make the engine reluctant to rev, causing boost etc to drop off as the engine demands fuel that just isn't there...

On a stock ecu, what in your mind would be optimum base pressure?

As of yet, I have no AFR reading system fitted... will be as soon as I can justify the coin.

lol, bit of a tangent, but I remember my first half decent motor (don't laugh) a XR3i - best thing I ever done to that was change the fuel filter, I honestly think it had the factory one still fitted - I bought it around 8 years old - made a huge difference to response and pull.

Was still slow as hell tho :D
Turbonoz
Posts: 727
Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2011 6:31 am

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

Post by Turbonoz »

rs007 wrote:to bring it back round to what we started talking about, I haven't checked my fuel pressure - and the fuel filter looks ancient - thats getting changed today. I guess if fuel pressure was down, fuel delivery would be down, and this would make the engine reluctant to rev, causing boost etc to drop off as the engine demands fuel that just isn't there...

On a stock ecu, what in your mind would be optimum base pressure?

As of yet, I have no AFR reading system fitted... will be as soon as I can justify the coin.

lol, bit of a tangent, but I remember my first half decent motor (don't laugh) a XR3i - best thing I ever done to that was change the fuel filter, I honestly think it had the factory one still fitted - I bought it around 8 years old - made a huge difference to response and pull.

Was still slow as hell tho :D


Low fuel pressure effectively gives you smaller injectors without letting the ECU know about it, if you see my meaning. You'll run lean as the ECU will still be calculating pulsewidths for the correct pressure. It would only be in very lean conditions 15:1+ where you'll feel the engine holding back briefly before going pop (I drove a 530bhp GTR that all of a sudden leaned out to 14.5 at full boost and and even then in the small amount of time it took me to lift off, it was still pulling well). If the engine demands fuel that isn't there, you'll likely get some knock and the ECU will pull timing but you'll still make the boost and you'll still be running lean.

On a stock ECU, the only base pressure to run is 36-38psi with the vac line disconnected (or engine off, ign on and bridging the Fp & B+ pins in the diagnostic port).

I used to love my Fords, had a bronze Escort MK3 1.6 Ghia that was way faster than it should have been. First time I ever did 100mph was in my little Fiesta 1.4 Sport with 3 others :shock:
92 MR2 Turbo Rev2 stock engine, Link G3 TURBONOZ mapped, T78: 487bhp & 364lbft; 11.78@120. NOW BREAKING: www.imoc.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?p=1542658
94 GTiR: 12.08@115 TOTB Sold :(
92 300ZX: 12.6@113 (415bhp) 570bhp, 500lbft
00 Clio 172
05 WRX PPP
rs007
Posts: 285
Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2012 9:30 pm

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

Post by rs007 »

Noz_13 wrote:
rs007 wrote:to bring it back round to what we started talking about, I haven't checked my fuel pressure - and the fuel filter looks ancient - thats getting changed today. I guess if fuel pressure was down, fuel delivery would be down, and this would make the engine reluctant to rev, causing boost etc to drop off as the engine demands fuel that just isn't there...

On a stock ecu, what in your mind would be optimum base pressure?

As of yet, I have no AFR reading system fitted... will be as soon as I can justify the coin.

lol, bit of a tangent, but I remember my first half decent motor (don't laugh) a XR3i - best thing I ever done to that was change the fuel filter, I honestly think it had the factory one still fitted - I bought it around 8 years old - made a huge difference to response and pull.

Was still slow as hell tho :D


Low fuel pressure effectively gives you smaller injectors without letting the ECU know about it, if you see my meaning. You'll run lean as the ECU will still be calculating pulsewidths for the correct pressure. It would only be in very lean conditions 15:1+ where you'll feel the engine holding back briefly before going pop (I drove a 530bhp GTR that all of a sudden leaned out to 14.5 at full boost and and even then in the small amount of time it took me to lift off, it was still pulling well). If the engine demands fuel that isn't there, you'll likely get some knock and the ECU will pull timing but you'll still make the boost and you'll still be running lean.

On a stock ECU, the only base pressure to run is 36-38psi with the vac line disconnected (or engine off, ign on and bridging the Fp & B+ pins in the diagnostic port).

I used to love my Fords, had a bronze Escort MK3 1.6 Ghia that was way faster than it should have been. First time I ever did 100mph was in my little Fiesta 1.4 Sport with 3 others :shock:


Good to hear my thinking confirmed - I'm no idiot, but I don't have the actual experience with these cars; building that rapidly tho.

Fuel filter changed, no real difference noted, haven't reset ecu right enough - I'll get the base pressure checked, just so another variable can be ticked off.

See, I can't even say the base timing is right - with it idling as high as 1200 when at temp, it is nowhere near the specified idle speed.

Its clear to me that I have to get it holding proper idle speed before I can be sure of anything, so I think I'll strip all the inlet side off, reseal it all back on, and pressure test the intercooler...
bobhatton
Posts: 3351
Joined: Fri Aug 25, 2006 9:34 pm
Location: Bodmin Cornwall

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

Post by bobhatton »

I would take off all your hoses from the air flow meter through to the inlet manifold and check for cracks and leaks. Also check all your small hoses off the manifold.
Then check your cam timing.
Next would be your ign timing.

The ECU is listening for detonation all the time and will make changes to the fuelling and timing, this could well keep your boost low. So once all the above and your idle is sorted put some NOS octane booster in your fuel, this will tell you if the ECU was getting any knock readings.

What I found on all my stock MR2s was some days they had lots of power and other not so much. I had some old bottles of octane booster that I had to get rid of so put them in one of the cars, well the difference was so great I realised that most of the time the ECU must have been getting knock readings and making changes to keep the engine safe but dropping the power.
Designer for turbo set ups on F1 cars, and Nitrous Oxide Systems of the USA in the 80s
rs007
Posts: 285
Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2012 9:30 pm

Re: [Mk2] [Turbo] turbo boost pressure

Post by rs007 »

bobhatton wrote:I would take off all your hoses from the air flow meter through to the inlet manifold and check for cracks and leaks. Also check all your small hoses off the manifold.
Then check your cam timing.
Next would be your ign timing.

The ECU is listening for detonation all the time and will make changes to the fuelling and timing, this could well keep your boost low. So once all the above and your idle is sorted put some NOS octane booster in your fuel, this will tell you if the ECU was getting any knock readings.

What I found on all my stock MR2s was some days they had lots of power and other not so much. I had some old bottles of octane booster that I had to get rid of so put them in one of the cars, well the difference was so great I realised that most of the time the ECU must have been getting knock readings and making changes to keep the engine safe but dropping the power.


Thanks Bob, more great info. There are so many little things I have had to put right with the car that it really would not surprise me if cam timing etc was out. I can't check ignition timing at idle, because it doesnt idle within spec when up to temp. But ill get it, I always do, just a matter of being methodical, and elliminating stuff!

The annoying thing is, some of the things I have had to put right are careless small things - yet apparently and according to reciepts, work was done by a tuning company (won't name) who the average Joe would assume know their stuff... But they've just been careless!
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